If Israel actually gave all Palestinians Israeli citizenship, you’d be right. But, that’s not going to happen. Why do you think the Nakba happened and Israel keeps rejecting Palestinian right of return? They want Israel to have a Jewish majority and they’re willing to commit Apartheid and ethnic cleansing to get it.
Are you aware of the fact how easy democracy can be turned into a dictatorship? Just look at Germany from 1930s.
Majority of Palestinians are quite radicalized. Take Gaza inhabitants, for instance. For the past 18 years Hamas was governing there and you know what’s Hamas’s main goal? To remove all the Jews and Israel altogether. Many Palestinian citizens actually support this narrative.
Now let’s be realistic: how many % could Hamas get in the Israel+Palestine elections. Just look at this poll: https://thehill.com/opinion/4273883-mellman-do-palestinians-support-hamas-polls-paint-a-murky-picture/
This means Hamas would probably get anywhere from 15-25% if there were joint in Israel+Palestine. Do I have to keep on explaining why this would be a catastrophe?
And also don’t forget to add some radical orthodox Jews who believe the entirety of the land was given by God to Jews…
For the same reason there aren’t joint elections between south and north korea…
This is unbelievable man. You are literally accusing me without proving one relevant argument whilst I in detail explained why at the moment it would have disastrous effects to let Palestinians vote in Israeli government.
And I am rather ignoring the Hitler note cause it’s rather funny.
Have you ever been to Israel and Palestine? Cause to me it seems like you have no clue what’s happening there and acting like you’re the most knowledgeable in the world.
There is this weird thing called comment history. I took a peek and you are hands down one of the more bigoted assholes here.
Take a peek at mine and you will see how much I know, I’ll wait dipshit.
That you can’t see how you are acting like a modern day Nazi is an amazing skill you have. Take off your blinders and look at what you have said if you just switch out the names of countries and peoples for say “whites” and “blacks”. I know you won’t honestly do it because you are steeped in propaganda and the cognitive dissonance would cook your brain.
Oh and just to make sure I’m clear I don’t show courtesy to racist’s. With that in mind… Fuck off bigot.
I have genuinely no idea how my comments resemble Nazis’ rhetoric. My family almost died due to Nazi regime, so I truly hate this regime.
What I have said it that Palestinians should not be allowed to vote in joint Palestine+Israel elections. Same for Israelis. In fact, I believe that there should never be a joint Israel+Palestine election (at least not in near future) because one-state solution does not seem realistic to me. How do you imagine 2 nations that are fighting for the past 70 years to have a single shared state? Do you honestly believe that such a state would work? Do you think there would be any culture in such parliament?
Hence why I believe that more-realistic is a 2 state solution where both Israel and Palestine would have their own elections (ideally). However, even option will not happen very soon because currently the relations are worse than ever. Still, I believe this is more probable than a single-state solution.
And yes, I would definitely like to see what you know and what your view is because so far you have presented zero facts. So far now it seems like all you can do is insult people who do not have exactly the same opinion as you do.
You are resorting to name calling rather than having a substantive conversation. You invoked Godwin’s law. I looked at their comment history and didn’t see any racism at least in the first page or so. Yours, however is full of outrage trolling and insults hurled, accusing those who disagree of being chatbots or arguing in bad faith. I feel bad for your 8-year-old If you behave like this in real life.
Are you talking about Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza, or Arab Israeli citizens with a Palestinian background? Because those are two very different legal categories. Arab Israelis have full legal rights. Palestinians don’t, because they’re not Israelis, which I’m pretty sure is something we all agree on. Israel doesn’t claim them, and you’d be screaming ethnic cleansing if it did.
Now what’s the exact issue you have? People who are not Israeli citizens and do not live in Israel cannot vote in Israeli elections. People who are citizens and who do live in Israel can vote. The housing discrimination that mentions is gross, I’ll admit, but that’s the main objectionable thing I see.
Do you want Israel to annex the West Bank or something?
I don’t want it, but even in the case of gaza and the west bank they are de facto under israeli control or even under permanent military occupation, with no expectation of diminishing but the opposite, isn’t this essentially an annexation but denying their rights?
gaza and the west bank they are de facto under israeli control or even under permanent military occupation,
Probably because they remain at war with Israel and have yet to stop attacking them or make a viable peace, choosing endless intifada and it’s predictable consequences instead.
Repeating those words like a mantra only serves to dilute them because you’re using them inappropriately.
Both Holocaust and apartheid generally refer to denying people rights or killing them because of their genetics and that’s clearly not what’s happening here. Israel is at war with Palestine because Palestine keeps trying to murder Israelis, not because of Palestinian genetics.
If you think anything happening is remotely comparable to the Holocaust, you don’t know anything about the Holocaust. If Israel was trying to exterminate Palestinians the way the Nazis tried to exterminate the Jews, Gaza would be a sheet of right now.
I also don’t have the right to vote in Israel, which makes sense, seeing as I don’t live there and I’m not a citizen. I weirdly don’t have the right to vote in Germany or Russian either.
I know that one time a holocaust survivor spoke of the thirst she felt during that time and how it was indescribable, and I think of all the missing Palestinians that had their bones crushed to rubble as they waited for hours to be rescued, and all those that didn’t survive. I think of how Israel dehumanized them and ethnically cleansed them, how they held back fuel and medical supplies that could save innocent lives, and I can’t help but draw comparison. The message of holocaust survivors was clear: Never again. Never again doesn’t mean denying it when it happens again. Never again means Palestinians too.
And that comparison is flawed, because there is a fundamental difference between a systematic effort to murder a population and a careless disregard for collateral damage during military operations.
Both are shameful; only one is a genocide. If you broaden the meaning of genocide to refer to any war operation that fails to sufficiently protect civilians, you’ve suddenly labeled most of military history as genocidal.
The bombing of Dresden was horrific, but it was not comparable to the literal Holocaust happening at the same time.
You are being intellectually dishonest. We are not taking about a German with voting rights in Russia. We are talking about a population being colonized by Israel, being tortured by Israel, being denied their land, their basic human rights, and their right to self determination. Gaza is not France, Israel is not Russia. This is more like Americans wiping out the native population, or apartheid south Africa. Gazans had their citizenhood stolen from them by Israel. And on top of that they treat Palestinian Israelis like shit…
The only democracy in the middle east my fucking ass…
Doubt it, 15% of Israel are Muslim. They would become Israeli citizens like the rest did.
If Israel actually gave all Palestinians Israeli citizenship, you’d be right. But, that’s not going to happen. Why do you think the Nakba happened and Israel keeps rejecting Palestinian right of return? They want Israel to have a Jewish majority and they’re willing to commit Apartheid and ethnic cleansing to get it.
They should let the people literally trying to murder them for the last 70 years elect their leaders? Brilliant plan.
Not doing this is apartheid/ethnic cleansing? Please. Gaza was given the chance to elect their leaders, they chose Hamas and intifada.
I bet they could negotiate for a right of return provided they are willing to pacify themselves and sue for a viable peace.
The Nakba happened because Palestinians declared war on Israel and lost.
You’re a disgusting and pathetic human being.
Edit: BTW how do I report people to the instance admins?
Pretty sure disagreeing with you isn’t against the rules. You just violated rule 5, however.
For justifying genocide/ethnic cleansing (take your pick).
I’m suggesting that those terms do not accurately describe what’s happening.
Removed by mod
“WE CAN’T LET THEM VOTE OR THEY MIGHT VOTE FOR THE WRONG PEOPLE!”
Put the mask back up, your authoritarian and bigoted cheeks are showing.
Are you aware of the fact how easy democracy can be turned into a dictatorship? Just look at Germany from 1930s.
Majority of Palestinians are quite radicalized. Take Gaza inhabitants, for instance. For the past 18 years Hamas was governing there and you know what’s Hamas’s main goal? To remove all the Jews and Israel altogether. Many Palestinian citizens actually support this narrative.
Now let’s be realistic: how many % could Hamas get in the Israel+Palestine elections. Just look at this poll: https://thehill.com/opinion/4273883-mellman-do-palestinians-support-hamas-polls-paint-a-murky-picture/ This means Hamas would probably get anywhere from 15-25% if there were joint in Israel+Palestine. Do I have to keep on explaining why this would be a catastrophe? And also don’t forget to add some radical orthodox Jews who believe the entirety of the land was given by God to Jews…
For the same reason there aren’t joint elections between south and north korea…
What a load of shit.
Justify your bigotry however you want, you are still acting in a way that would make Hitler proud of you.
This is unbelievable man. You are literally accusing me without proving one relevant argument whilst I in detail explained why at the moment it would have disastrous effects to let Palestinians vote in Israeli government. And I am rather ignoring the Hitler note cause it’s rather funny.
Have you ever been to Israel and Palestine? Cause to me it seems like you have no clue what’s happening there and acting like you’re the most knowledgeable in the world.
There is this weird thing called comment history. I took a peek and you are hands down one of the more bigoted assholes here.
Take a peek at mine and you will see how much I know, I’ll wait dipshit.
That you can’t see how you are acting like a modern day Nazi is an amazing skill you have. Take off your blinders and look at what you have said if you just switch out the names of countries and peoples for say “whites” and “blacks”. I know you won’t honestly do it because you are steeped in propaganda and the cognitive dissonance would cook your brain.
Oh and just to make sure I’m clear I don’t show courtesy to racist’s. With that in mind… Fuck off bigot.
I have genuinely no idea how my comments resemble Nazis’ rhetoric. My family almost died due to Nazi regime, so I truly hate this regime.
What I have said it that Palestinians should not be allowed to vote in joint Palestine+Israel elections. Same for Israelis. In fact, I believe that there should never be a joint Israel+Palestine election (at least not in near future) because one-state solution does not seem realistic to me. How do you imagine 2 nations that are fighting for the past 70 years to have a single shared state? Do you honestly believe that such a state would work? Do you think there would be any culture in such parliament?
Hence why I believe that more-realistic is a 2 state solution where both Israel and Palestine would have their own elections (ideally). However, even option will not happen very soon because currently the relations are worse than ever. Still, I believe this is more probable than a single-state solution.
And yes, I would definitely like to see what you know and what your view is because so far you have presented zero facts. So far now it seems like all you can do is insult people who do not have exactly the same opinion as you do.
You are resorting to name calling rather than having a substantive conversation. You invoked Godwin’s law. I looked at their comment history and didn’t see any racism at least in the first page or so. Yours, however is full of outrage trolling and insults hurled, accusing those who disagree of being chatbots or arguing in bad faith. I feel bad for your 8-year-old If you behave like this in real life.
Second-class citizens. Almost all palestinians do not even have the right to vote, and even those who do have fewer rights.
Gazans were given the right to vote and they voted for Hamas, who did a coup and made sure that no other elections would be held again.
Are you talking about Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza, or Arab Israeli citizens with a Palestinian background? Because those are two very different legal categories. Arab Israelis have full legal rights. Palestinians don’t, because they’re not Israelis, which I’m pretty sure is something we all agree on. Israel doesn’t claim them, and you’d be screaming ethnic cleansing if it did.
Not only.
Props to the graphic designer.
Now what’s the exact issue you have? People who are not Israeli citizens and do not live in Israel cannot vote in Israeli elections. People who are citizens and who do live in Israel can vote. The housing discrimination that mentions is gross, I’ll admit, but that’s the main objectionable thing I see.
Do you want Israel to annex the West Bank or something?
I don’t want it, but even in the case of gaza and the west bank they are de facto under israeli control or even under permanent military occupation, with no expectation of diminishing but the opposite, isn’t this essentially an annexation but denying their rights?
Probably because they remain at war with Israel and have yet to stop attacking them or make a viable peace, choosing endless intifada and it’s predictable consequences instead.
The exact issue is that Israel is repeating both the holocaust and apartheid all at the same time.
Since fucking when is it NOT an issue that people don’t have the same rights? Wtf
Repeating those words like a mantra only serves to dilute them because you’re using them inappropriately.
Both Holocaust and apartheid generally refer to denying people rights or killing them because of their genetics and that’s clearly not what’s happening here. Israel is at war with Palestine because Palestine keeps trying to murder Israelis, not because of Palestinian genetics.
Isrsel is indiscriminately bombing a whole ethnic group. How can you deny this?
If you think anything happening is remotely comparable to the Holocaust, you don’t know anything about the Holocaust. If Israel was trying to exterminate Palestinians the way the Nazis tried to exterminate the Jews, Gaza would be a sheet of right now.
I also don’t have the right to vote in Israel, which makes sense, seeing as I don’t live there and I’m not a citizen. I weirdly don’t have the right to vote in Germany or Russian either.
I know that one time a holocaust survivor spoke of the thirst she felt during that time and how it was indescribable, and I think of all the missing Palestinians that had their bones crushed to rubble as they waited for hours to be rescued, and all those that didn’t survive. I think of how Israel dehumanized them and ethnically cleansed them, how they held back fuel and medical supplies that could save innocent lives, and I can’t help but draw comparison. The message of holocaust survivors was clear: Never again. Never again doesn’t mean denying it when it happens again. Never again means Palestinians too.
And that comparison is flawed, because there is a fundamental difference between a systematic effort to murder a population and a careless disregard for collateral damage during military operations.
Both are shameful; only one is a genocide. If you broaden the meaning of genocide to refer to any war operation that fails to sufficiently protect civilians, you’ve suddenly labeled most of military history as genocidal.
The bombing of Dresden was horrific, but it was not comparable to the literal Holocaust happening at the same time.
You are being intellectually dishonest. We are not taking about a German with voting rights in Russia. We are talking about a population being colonized by Israel, being tortured by Israel, being denied their land, their basic human rights, and their right to self determination. Gaza is not France, Israel is not Russia. This is more like Americans wiping out the native population, or apartheid south Africa. Gazans had their citizenhood stolen from them by Israel. And on top of that they treat Palestinian Israelis like shit…
The only democracy in the middle east my fucking ass…
And did you ask yourself why they don’t have the right to vote? It was decision made by Hamas and PLO not to organize another election.
So outright annexation.
In multiple steps, yes.