Entrusting our speech to multiple different corporate actors is always risky. Yet given how most of the internet is currently structured, our online expression largely depends on a set of private companies ranging from our direct Internet service providers and platforms, to upstream ISPs (sometimes...
    • Lettuce eat lettuce@lemmy.mlEnglish
      20·
      vuosi sitten

      Here’s a scenario: I’m a wizard with the magical ability to clone any object I point at. I see a person with a Rolex watch on their wrist. I point to it and instantly a perfect copy of that Rolex appears on my wrist.

      What got stolen? Who got robbed? Who is deprived of anything? And don’t say Rolex got deprived of money, because they still have exactly as much money as before, and nobody is “owed” profit.

      If people could be owed profit just because they did work, then I could run around parking lots all day cleaning off people’s cars and then forcing them to pay for my services when they got back.

      If people could be owed profit just for creating things, I could go around town singing my original music to people passing by and then forcing them to pay for listening to it.

      Both of those scenarios are obviously ridiculous.

      Pirating digital media is wrong in the same way that poaching unicorns is wrong. It’s not, because unicorns don’t actually exist, and neither does intellectual property, it’s a myth, a fable, a fabrication that is enforced by powerful corpos in order to forcefully extract undeserved profits from a market of artificial scarcity that they created in the first place.

        • Lettuce eat lettuce@lemmy.mlEnglish
          3·
          vuosi sitten

          Respond to my scenario I proposed, if I magically cloned an object like a Rolex, what got stolen? Who is deprived of something? What are they deprived of and how?

          The difference being, those people didn’t ask for your music, but you needed that software, otherwise you wouldn’t use it.

          Nope, I didn’t necessarily need the software. The point of that illustration is that people and companies aren’t owed profit on something merely because they created it. Money is owned in a mutual social contract, and I don’t agree to that contract for purchase. The reason why that’s not theft though in the case of digital “piracy” is because Nobody Is Being Deprived Of Anything.

          Until you can show me clearly what Rolex or the person wearing the Rolex is being deprived of in that example I gave, theft hasn’t been demonstrated because theft means depriving somebody of something against their will or desire. Copying Is Not Theft.

          Lol, so basically confirming my last paragraph then, “doesn’t actually exist” because its digital, what a take.

          Nope, wrong again. Read what I said more carefully, intellectual property, not just digital. If I go to the library, grab a textbook and hand copy that book onto my own paper, that is totally fine.

          If Intellectual property is real, please explain to me how somebody can have an idea “stolen” from them? How would a person be “robbed” of a concept? Here’s an idea I’m making up: “Zixatubayponawa” which is a far away land where the rivers are purple sugar water. Tell me how you would “steal” that from me.

    • Pelicanen@sopuli.xyzEnglish
      8·
      vuosi sitten

      Out of curiosity, what are you’re thoughts on the below scenarios:

      • attempted robbery If you go to a bank and attempt to steal money, but you were unsuccessful in doing so, there wouldn’t be any loss, but you’d still go to jail and it’s widely accepted as wrong.
      • getting a service, e.g going to the barbers and running out of the store before paying There wouldn’t be a loss again

      Those aren’t really good equivalents since in the first example, you’re trying to take something away from someone but you fail. The law is not concerned with your skill, just your intent. Attempted murder is illegal even if the victim is still alive.

      In the second example, there is absolutely a loss. The barber would have spent time and used resources in order to provide you with that service that they wouldn’t get compensated for. Your involvement directly costs them money and time, unlike with piracy where even a billion people pirating won’t cost the developer any more money than if those people just never played it to begin with.

      • uis@lemmy.worldEnglish
        6·
        vuosi sitten

        Your involvement directly costs them money and time, unlike with piracy where even a billion people pirating won’t cost the developer any more money than if those people just never played it to begin with.

        Sometimes “legal” is even worse for developers than pirated:

    • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldEnglish
      7·
      vuosi sitten

      You can legally go to the library, xerox every page in a book and leave. Legally. The publishers and author don’t get a penny. What is the difference between that and pirating something online other than it being easier and more convenient?

    • uis@lemmy.worldEnglish
      6·
      vuosi sitten

      attempted robbery
      If you go to a bank and attempt to steal money, but you were unsuccessful in doing so, there wouldn’t be any loss, but you’d still go to jail and it’s widely accepted as wrong.

      Unsuccessful attempt to take away? Well, you can point out who was loosing files.

      you’re leeching off someone else’s time and resources, and taking away money that could have been paid to them, for your own selfish desires.

      Except saud developers were fired 10 years ago. If you were truly pro-copyright, you would make it personal and inalienable.

    • RobotToaster@infosec.pubEnglish
      5·
      vuosi sitten

      If you go to a bank and attempt to steal money, but you were unsuccessful in doing so, there wouldn’t be any loss, but you’d still go to jail and it’s widely accepted as wrong.

      Theft is taking property with the intention to permanently deprive the owner of it, which you were attempting to do

      getting a service, e.g going to the barbers and running out of the store before paying

      Technically fraud not theft.